[fziegler]

On my Samsung tablet, I have my PDF files in thematically sorted folders. When adding new songs, MSP creates additional folders outside those collections - one per song. This way, I'm not able to keep my storage tidy.

There are different way I create new songs:
a) Sometimes, I copy a file from a NAS onto the tablet first, then open MSP and create a new file;
b) sometimes, I'm already in MSP, start creating a new song ('song > new > system file manager'), open my file explorer (from Speed Software) and copy the PDF sheet to the tablet before immediately selecting it for a new song;
c) sometimes, I select 'import > system file manager'.

How can I avoid all those new folders? And why is MSP copying the already existing file a second time to another location?

[Zubersoft]

If you are on an Android device and you don't want MobileSheets to copy your imported files, uncheck Settings->Storage->Let MobileSheets Manage my Files. Then you have to manage them yourself and there are downsides to this. Otherwise change the storage location under Settings->Storage->Set the MobileSheets Storage Location and import your files from within the storage location. You can also uncheck Settings->Storage->Create Subdirectory per Song if you don't want that behavior. If you import from cloud storage, files are downloaded, so they are always copied into the storage location.

Mike

[fziegler]

Yes, I'm on an Android device.

I unchecked 'Settings > Storage > Let MobileSheets Manage my Files' from the beginning, and it is still unchecked.

The MobileSheets storage location is set to a special folder on a SD card (sheet music) - with a number of subfolders like 'hobby band', 'christmas', 'personal', 'job'. The songs were imported from one of those folders each.

The database is not published.

Unfortunately, I can't uncheck 'Settings->Storage->Create Subdirectory per Song' as this is greyed out (it's checked, indeed).

I don't import from my network storage or a cloud directly to exactly prevent the behaviour I encounter now. I always open the 'Explorer' app, copy the file to the sheet music directory inside the file explorer and select the copied version. 

And I'm pretty sure it wasn't that way for years. It only started happening recently.

[McAroni]

If you check "Let MobileSheets Manage my Files" then you should be able to uncheck "create subdirectories....." After that you could uncheck "Let MobileSheets Manage my Files" again, but i am not sure if that makes any difference.

[fziegler]

Thanks for that idea. It had an effect, but not what I wanted:

Before, when importing a song, a dedicated folder was created and a version of that sheet music (PDF) copied to the folder. Now, after disabling that 'create subdirectories' option, I get a new copy into the library root folder. Argh.

As I only recently started to directly create a local copy of my file from the NAS on my tablet inside the file selection dialog and directly select the newly created file: Could it be that the app checks the existence of the file from an older version of the library directory (before opening the file selction dialog) and then believes to need to copy that file? Even if I created it meanwhile?

That would be an explanation why I didn't encounter that problem before and also others don't seem so.

My problem is this: When I tidy up my library folder, I erase all those new subdirectories and will have a library entry with no sheet music (because I deleted the version connected - the file I originally connected to the song isn't the version stored in the data base entry). So I tidy up my folder and try to find all new songs that need a re-attribution of the sheet music. A hell of unnecessary work - only because I want to add a new song from my NAS in one step.

[fziegler]

So, indeed, everything's fine when I already have my file copied before starting the import process.

That's exactly what I wanted to avoid: To always need two steps (close MSP, open file browser, copy file, close file browser, open MSP, import file).

[Zubersoft]

I'll definitely need a list of steps to take to reproduce whatever problem is occurring. So far I have gathered from your posts that if "Let MobileSheets Manage my Files" is unchecked but Create Subdirectory per Songs is checked, you are seeing a situation where folders can be created. But I need to know what actions to take to cause a folder to be created, as I've never seen that occur when "Let MobileSheets Manage my Files" is unchecked.

I'm assuming you have granted the all files access permission to MobileSheets as well as the Storage permission. Failure to grant these would cause permission issues with accessing files. You should be aware that if you are using a removable SD card, MobileSheets will not have write access to that location but this generally does not matter if you are managing files yourself. However, I'm not sure how it could be creating folders on the SD card then unless you also set the MobileSheets storage location to the same SD card folder you are using. If you did this, that would be problematic for determining the root cause of the problem.

It will help to know if you are using Import->Local File most of the time to import your files or one of the other options. If you are using one of the other options, MobileSheets will have to copy the file into the storage location, so you can't really avoid this problem.

Thanks,
Mike

[McAroni]

So, indeed, everything's fine when I already have my file copied before starting the import process.

I always bring the files to the device first before importing. Sometimes msp does some strange things regarding moving Files to the right place.
I manage my file structure via an folder sync app. If the files are at the right place before importing everything works fine.
If the folder structure does not matter then you will not even recognize if there are the files sometimes not on the right place. Everything still works fine.
But for me it is important, so i do the sync of the files folder my own way.

[fziegler]

The crucial point now seems to be that I imported songs by

• Import > System file manager > Explorer
  

That way, I was able to open my special file manager app 'Explorer' which allows me to access my sheet music directory on our home NAS via smb://xyz/. All files I create with my computer (e.g. PDFs from a notation software or an edited scan) are stored in that directory. I was happy to be able to directly import from that storage into MSP by having open multiple tabs in that file manager and copying a remote file via SMB to the local library directory. And thought that MSP then should behave the same way as it does with local files that were there from the beginning.

I didn't realise my problem came from that point. I thought it had to do with some odd behaviour from MSP in cooperation with that file manager app.

Let's see what you might need to know:

• permissions: storage concerning media files, camera, no permission for locality determination
  
• settings: MSP is not meant to manage my storage; the MobileSheets directory is placed on a microSD card; the data base is not in the MobileSheets directory; original files aren't deleted after copying (but greyed out); subdirectories may be created for songs (but greyed out); my problem has nothing to do with any cloud system (Dropbox, Google, OneDrive);
  
• I start by Import > system file manager or by New > Add file > system file manager
  
• I get a selection of different sources, amoung them my additional file manager 'Explorer' which I select
  
• Explorer opens up with its different tabs, I select the SMB tab to access my NAS, copy a newly created file, switch to the tablet's local directory tab and put the copied file into the appropriate subdirectory (say 'Jazz standards'), immediately select it for importing and hit [OK]
  
• I get MSP's import dialog with a deduced song name (from the file name) and continue to fill in the data fields, import the song and that's it.
  

I didn't expect there was anything needed to be copied as everything is on place when terminating the import. But of course only then - the file wasn't locally accessible when starting the import procedure.

As you say only importing local files will help against copies, I may go back to my initial handling - the same way McAroni does ist.

I now learned as well that I may be able to avoid subdirectories being created when unchecking that greyed-out option. That may help against subdirectories as well when I import files directly from the camera (which happens every now and then in the band - in that case the subdirectories have names derived from the momentary date).

So, you didn't solve my issue but shed a lot of light onto the thing - and I'll be able to work around all that stuff. Thanks a lot!

[fziegler]

However, I'm not sure how it could be creating folders on the SD card then unless you also set the MobileSheets storage location to the same SD card folder you are using. If you did this, that would be problematic for determining the root cause of the problem.

That's exactly what I did: use the same directory for my files (PDFs and audio) and for MobileSheets' storage. I thought this could be best practice in order to get both MSP's import files and my files integrated in one storage place.

I'm not sure any more that there is a problem. Looks more like a design choice from your side, if only 'import local file' allows to not have files being copied.

Are there other strategies? In the end, I want to be able to easily sync a second tablet for backup.

[itsme]

With "Let MobileSheets manage my files" unchecked MobileSheets leaves files where they are if they are already inside the MobileSheets storage location or a subfolder of it. Files are copied into the root folder of the MobileSheets storage location if they are imported 'from outside' to make sure that MobileSheets can be used offline. The MobileSheets storage location has to be 'local' - in internal memory or on a local SD card.
A solution for you would be to synchronize your folder structure on the NAS to an identical folder structure on the SD card with a synchronisation tool like FolderSyncPro https://play.google.com/store/apps/detai...rsync.full and import from the SD card with "Import local file".
FolderSyncPro works fine for me. There are other similar synchronization tools that should also work.

@Mike: is a combination of MobileSheets' "Sync Library" and "Let MobileSheets manage my files"=OFF intended to work? For fziegler the folder to sync with would be on his NAS. I would like to synchronize to a folder on my GoogleDrive - preferably using two way sync so that editing of ChordPro files is possible both in GoogleDrive and directly in MobileSheets.

[fziegler]

Thanks for that - nice idea, too! 

In fact, my job comprises music edition and making music at the same time. Worst of all: Both parts overlap. So my solution wouldn't have been to sync the whole sheet music I have on my NAS to my poor tablet - only selected portions of that. But I could consider that way, as well. There's enough space on the SD card.

Your first sentence obviously isn't true as I now found out: It seems to be only true as long as you use Import > Local File and not Import > System File Manager. That's what I encountered. Always wondered about those different approaches. Now I know.

[Zubersoft]

The system file browser does not allow direct access to the selected file (because Google's file picker will let you pick from any external application). What is provided to MobileSheets is just a stream of data. I have to save that stream of data somewhere (I'm not given a file path, as that wouldn't make sense if the user selected a file in the cloud, for example). So that's why the file is treated as if it's "external" to the device, because from the perspective of MobileSheets, it is. Import->Local File gives direct access to the selected file, including the file path, so that's why nothing is copied or moved when using that approach.

@Mike: is a combination of MobileSheets' "Sync Library" and "Let MobileSheets manage my files"=OFF intended to work? For fziegler the folder to sync with would be on his NAS. I would like to synchronize to a folder on my GoogleDrive - preferably using two way sync so that editing of ChordPro files is possible both in GoogleDrive and directly in MobileSheets

itsme - I don't think the Sync Library feature would be a good choice for users that manage their own files because MobileSheets will have to copy files to the storage location if they don't already exist in the library.

Mike

[fziegler]

I think I'm at the point to thank you all for jumping in! The case is discussed, my bad to interpret the option 'Import > System File Browser' (or whatever it is in English - I read it in German as 'System-Dateimanager') in a misleading way. I now understand that the method only allows to use alternative file managers by a totally different approach. Which is not based on file handling at all (you, Mike, say, it's handling an octet stream).

The only issue remaining is: Should I change my file handling within MSP? I initially found it handy to have the PDFs on my tablet in an openly accessible storage - that way, it's not only viewable with MSP, but with any app that shows PDFs. Quite a number of music I have consist in single lead sheets that I use in different contexts, others are full arrangements and need to be flipped by a BT pedal in a standardised band context. And yet others again consist in whole song books. With my ~1400 titles from around 500 files, I still prefer sorting them into thematical folders.

One more thing remains a request/wish for the moment: The longer I use MSP, the more versions I have from the same song - ChoPro and PDF versions, different keys, songs with different verses printed - different sheets for different occasions: Singing with children at school, singing in sunday service with elderly, playing piano, singing myself... As far as I see, there isn't an option to assign multiple files to one song, keep them all (including comments) and be able to blend in or out one ore another version, right? Or whatever mechanism would bundle part of those versions together. But this must have been discussed before...
For the moment, I try to identify the different versions by their title (with comments in brackets). But haven't included the Type tag into the library view yet - only the arrangement if it's written music (I use the Musician/Interpret tag for that).

By the way, I think you are doing a great job, Mike! I loved the rework of the annotations engine and use it massively. Couldn't live without. And I'm excited to be able to recommend MSP to iPad users now. Great mile stones. And as I may not have song mode any more on the next Nord Stage, I hope to get PC commands work from my tablet one day (I know they should).

[BRX]

Well, to chime in, I have been syncing my sheets folder manually or rather with synctools like FolderSync and ResilioSync beetween devices longer than Mike provided the internal sync functions which I haven't used so far.

The reason I'm sticking with this indeed is that I like to have my complete sheets folder which contains other sheets which can't be read by MS (yet) available on all my devices. So I synced it completely between devices and just copied the mobilesheets.db as needed.

Though since I added an iPad to my tablet fleet with its damned file restrictions and the sandbox I can't continue this like that any more. So I'm considering the sync features. But I'm still not sure how best to keep my file structures (including MS non-compatible files) the same with iOS in play. I definitely want keep handling my files myself.

Mike, how will effect syncing changes and new files from an iPad to devices on Android and Windows where MS doesn't handle the filemanaging?