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Windows 10 ARM Stability?
#1
Hello,

I've recently begun using MobileSheets on a brand new Microsoft Surface Pro X, which runs Windows 10 on an ARM processor. Though the application listing in the Microsoft store lists ARM as a compatible operating system, I have been experiencing major stability issues, with the application crashing frequently during different tasks. The actions that cause crashing have been so varied that I don't believe I have a complete list but it includes:

Turning multiple pages quickly with bluetooth pedal
Zooming in and panning in overlay mode
Entering cataloguing info during import using pen stylus
Opening a score

Is there anything I might be able to do to improve the stability of MobileSheets on my computer, or is an ARM update addressing these issues available?
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#2
From what I can see in the reported crash logs, the Surface Pro X is reporting running out of memory which is causing the app to crash more than any other device. So I think there is some kind of memory issue with MobileSheets on the Surface Pro X. The next major update that includes the annotation redesign is making a number of changes that should significantly reduce memory usage and switch more of the processing to the GPU instead of the CPU. My hope is that this will help with all of the stability issues you are seeing. Right now I don't have a Surface Pro X to test on myself and that is the only Windows 10 ARM device I'm aware of. Unfortunately, due to COVID-19, I can't really justify the expense of getting a Surface Pro X for testing at the moment, so I will have to work with Surface Pro X users to ensure that these issues are resolved.

Mike
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#3
(06-15-2020, 05:32 AM)Zubersoft Wrote: From what I can see in the reported crash logs, the Surface Pro X is reporting running out of memory which is causing the app to crash more than any other device. So I think there is some kind of memory issue with MobileSheets on the Surface Pro X. The next major update that includes the annotation redesign is making a number of changes that should significantly reduce memory usage and switch more of the processing to the GPU instead of the CPU. My hope is that this will help with all of the stability issues you are seeing. Right now I don't have a Surface Pro X to test on myself and that is the only Windows 10 ARM device I'm aware of. Unfortunately, due to COVID-19, I can't really justify the expense of getting a Surface Pro X for testing at the moment, so I will have to work with Surface Pro X users to ensure that these issues are resolved.

Mike
Thanks so much for your help in checking out the crash logs. For now I'll try to run the app without anything else in the background, and I'll be looking forward to the next update. I'm happy to provide any Surface Pro X- related feedback you might need!

Grant
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#4
I've been running MSP on a Surface Pro X and have also been experiencing a lot of crashes. It's the higher end 16 GB model, too. But, I mean, the stability and compatibility issues with the SPX are legion, so it's not surprising. Sigh--if only it weren't such a perfect display, pen and keyboard.
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#5
(06-15-2020, 04:57 AM)Grantviolin Wrote: Hello,

I've recently begun using MobileSheets on a brand new Microsoft Surface Pro X, which runs Windows 10 on an ARM processor. Though the application listing in the Microsoft store lists ARM as a compatible operating system, I have been experiencing major stability issues, with the application crashing frequently during different tasks. The actions that cause crashing have been so varied that I don't believe I have a complete list but it includes:

Turning multiple pages quickly with bluetooth pedal
Zooming in and panning in overlay mode
Entering cataloguing info during import using pen stylus
Opening a score

Is there anything I might be able to do to improve the stability of MobileSheets on my computer, or is an ARM update addressing these issues available?

Hi there, 

Is the issue resolved for you now in October?  I am interested in a Surface pro X but Mobilsheets would be a main app. I would be quite useful to be able to annotate so easily with the pen and all.  But of course it won't make sense to get one if this does not work properly.

What I hear is that  64 bit apps mostly do not run on he pro X because of the ARM processor, it can only run 32 bit apps at this time. 

Is the Windows Mobile sheets app 64 bit? 

Thanks! - Sylvia
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#6
Hello Sylvia,

Unfortunately, I depend on some third party libraries that do not support ARM64. So I'm unable to create an ARM64 version of MobileSheets. I haven't had a Surface Pro X user test the latest beta version yet - my hope is that the latest changes will help with the memory issues. Just for reference, the 32-bit ARM version of MobileSheets runs on the Surface Pro X.

Mike
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#7
(10-19-2020, 08:10 AM)Zubersoft Wrote: Hello Sylvia,

Unfortunately, I depend on some third party libraries that do not support ARM64. So I'm unable to create an ARM64 version of MobileSheets. I haven't had a Surface Pro X user test the latest beta version yet - my hope is that the latest changes will help with the memory issues. Just for reference, the 32-bit ARM version of MobileSheets runs on the Surface Pro X.

Mike

Thank you Mike. 

So that sounds to me like there is a 32 bit MobileSheets version which would/should run on the Surface pro X. Hopefully one of the users here who have a Surface pro X can beta test. However...since you are optimistic that it should run the I might just get one and do the beta testing for you. Would that be useful? With so few having this tablet  yetyou might have bigger fish to fry though. 

It sounds also like Microsoft is working on making this tablet more compatible with existing windows apps https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/surface...erformance:
  • 64-bit (x64) apps. With 64-bit emulation coming soon in Preview via the Windows Insider program, you'll be able to run 64-bit (x64) apps on Surface Pro X. Without 64-bit emulation support, you can run 64-bit (ARM64) apps, 32-bit (ARM32) apps, or 32-bit (x86) apps (using the x86 emulator). You can usually find 32-bit (x86) versions of apps, but some app developers only offer 64-bit (x64) apps.

Cheers! - Sylvia
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#8
It would certainly be useful to have someone to beta test the changes to see if they help on the Surface Pro X.  I'm not even sure if an ARM64 build would address any of the issues users have seen, as the little bit of information I've been able to gather made it seem related to memory.

Thanks,
Mike
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#9
(10-19-2020, 06:02 PM)Zubersoft Wrote: It would certainly be useful to have someone to beta test the changes to see if they help on the Surface Pro X.  I'm not even sure if an ARM64 build would address any of the issues users have seen, as the little bit of information I've been able to gather made it seem related to memory.

Thanks,
Mike

I'm not even sure if an ARM64 build would address any of the issues users have seen, as the little bit of information I've been able to gather made it seem related to memory.

Supposedly 32 bit (x86) apps should run stable on that tablet (via emulation), Microsoft says. Do you have a MobileSheets version in 32 bit (x86)? 

I'll let you know if I get that tablet but it may not be necessary for you to rebuild much. The ball seems to be in Microsoft's court mostly to build stable x86 emulators. 

I'll reach out to you if I get that tablet - cheers! - Sylvia
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#10
Generally speaking, I would have thought you would be better off using a tablet which doesn't use a "new" emulator; this should result in fewer issues for you and also be less distracting for Mike (who appears to be coding like mad on the annotations update after which he will be developing the IOS version).

Of course, if you have already bought this tablet then the above doesn't apply.

Cheers
Geoff
Samsung Galaxy Tab A6
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#11
(10-20-2020, 05:10 AM)Geoff Bacon Wrote: Generally speaking, I would have thought you would be better off using a tablet which doesn't use a "new" emulator; this should result in fewer issues for you and also be less distracting for Mike (who appears to be coding like mad on the annotations update after which he will be developing the IOS version).

Of course, if you have already bought this tablet then the above doesn't apply.

Cheers
Geoff

Totally agree Geoff and I did not ask Mike to do or change anything. My question was for information: Is MobileSheets for Windows app an x86 32 bit or 64 bit app?  I hoped to find the answer here on this forum.  I hoped that there would be a 32 bit (x86) version but it seems there is not. 

So lets this topic rest for now and maybe one day one of the posters above  who have the device already can report that it works (because Microsoft is working on making it compatible with existing apps).  Yep - there is nothing for Mike here to do, fully agree, he has more important things on his plate. This is a unicorn of a topic, sort of anyways.

Cheers! - Sylvia
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#12
MobileSheets is available for x86, x64 and ARM32. When I publish the installer, it has all three CPU types available in it and installs the correct one based on the CPU type of the device.

Mike
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#13
(10-20-2020, 08:19 AM)Zubersoft Wrote: MobileSheets is available for x86, x64 and ARM32. When I publish the installer, it has all three CPU types available in it and installs the correct one based on the CPU type of the device.

Mike

Wow, thanks Mike. I hope you do not have too many versions to maintain, sounds like a lot of work!
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